Getting Ready for the Wayeb

topic posted Sun, March 2, 2008 - 9:19 AM by  offlineHoopes
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Despite all the attention to the Maya calendar, I haven't seen much discussion of the "wayeb" (sometimes spelled "uayeb"): Five "nameless" days that come each year at the end of the "haab" or 365-day calendar.

"Wayeb" was a kind of 19th "dwarf" month in the cycle of 18 X 20-day solar months that provided a transition between each 360-day year. There are suggestions that the ancient Maya regarded the Wayeb as a period of heightened liminality. These were considered to be unlucky or hazardous "days of awe." They were associated with resting or sleep and were a period during which people engaged in fasting and rituals of purification. They also refrained from beginning new enterprises.

The days of the wayeb this year (according to the 584283 correlation that also gives 12/21/12 as 13.0.0.0.0 4 Ajaw 3 K'ank'in) are:

0 Wayeb - Saturday, March 29
1 Wayeb - Sunday, March 30
2 Wayeb - Monday, March 31
3 Wayeb - Tuesday, April 1
4 Wayeb - Wednesday, April 2

In 2012, the days of the wayeb will be:

0 Wayeb - Wednesday, March 28
1 Wayeb - Thursday, March 29
2 Wayeb - Friday, March 30
3 Wayeb - Saturday, March 31
4 Wayeb - Sunday, April 1
posted by:
Hoopes
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  • Wayeb Out~

    Sun, March 2, 2008 - 10:42 PM
    thanks for that Light Hoopes...

    what is "heightened liminality"
    • Re: Wayeb Out~

      Mon, March 3, 2008 - 2:15 AM
      Thanks for the info. I looked up "liminality".

      "the transitional period or phase of a rite of passage, during which the participant lacks social status or rank, remains anonymous, shows obedience and humility, and follows prescribed forms of conduct, dress, etc."

      I'd like to know what this meant to the ancient mayans. It sounds a lot like other cultures who mix up social distinctions by reversing roles between servants and masters or the like for a time each year to diminish social pressures.

      • Re: Wayeb Out~

        Mon, March 3, 2008 - 8:33 AM
        The most detailed discussion of Uayeb rituals comes from Bishop Diego de Landa, the same fanatical Catholic cleric who burned hundreds of Maya codices, which is probably not the most reliable source (though his information is always rich in clues...)

        Here's an online discussion of harvest festivals by Allen Christenson, an excellent ethnographer who also happens to be Mormon:

        maxwellinstitute.byu.edu/display.php

        However, the days of the Wayeb would have been at the end of the dry season, not the harvest season.

        Figuring out the real scoop on these issues always requires a critical reading, since everyone brings some kind of bias to the table.

        I'm still hunting for some better informaiton on the five days of the Wayeb. Googling on "Wayeb" or "Uayeb" gets a mixed bag of stuff and I haven't had an opportunity to hunt for this in the library yet.

        I seem to recall once seeing a reference that likened the Wayeb to Saturnalia. However, from what I've read it doesn't seem to have been a festive time but rather the opposite.
  • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

    Thu, March 20, 2008 - 7:39 PM
    Another bump. The Wayeb begin a week from Saturday.
    • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

      Thu, March 20, 2008 - 8:37 PM
      i have an article about the wayeb and leap day in the lastest episode of Second Creation Magazine (it was uploaded on leap day this year).

      strong connection with saturnalia is made, but probably not in the way you might think

      first half of the article is kinda a general academic thing (well in my own way), and the second half gets more into galacto-earthwizard insanity

      Leap Year Lore of the Lunar Wizard
      www.tortuga.com/portal/fil...pisode3.pdf

      well, this published version is actually not my final final draft, and it's also missing the footnotes (although still retains the indicative asterisks lol), but i'll take what i can get... hey they gave me 8 pages so i ain't complaining... yea kinda long but well worth the read imho
      and if yer skeptical of the magazines woo woo leanings i'll include my bibliography here in attempt to mitigate.

      enjoy

      Citations:
      (1) Rackham, H.; Cicero – De Natura Deorum,
      Harvard University Press, 1933.
      www.theoi.com/Protogenos/Khronos.html

      (2) Edmonson, Munro S.; The Ancient Future of the
      Itza: The Book of Chilam Balam of Tizimin, University
      of Texas Press, 1982.

      (3) Malmstrom, Vincent H.; Cycles of the Moon,
      Mysteries of the Moon: The Calendar in Mesoamerican
      Civilization, University of Texas Press, 1997.

      (4) Edmonson, Munro S.; The Mayan Calendar Reform
      of 11.16.0.0.0., Current Anthropology 17: 713-17,
      197 6.

      (5) Edmonson, Munro S.; The Book of the Year: Middle
      American Calendrical Systems, University of Utah
      Press, 1988.

      (6) Powell, Christopher; Maya Exploration Center,
      personal communication, 2007.

      (7) Craine, Eugene R. and Reindorp, Reginald C.; The
      Codex Perez and the Chilam Balam of Mani, University
      of Oklahoma Press, 1970.

      (8) Itzep, Rigoberto; Mision Maya Wajshakib Batz,
      personal communication, 2007.

      Additional Sources:

      Bolles, David; Combined Dictionary–Concordance of
      the Yucatecan Mayan Language, 1997
      www.famsi.org/reports/96072/index.html

      Calendar Converter
      www.diagnosis2012.co.uk/conv.htm




      • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

        Sun, March 23, 2008 - 2:23 PM
        THE HAAB - The Cycle of the Solar Earth

        The Haab is the solar cycle of earth. It uses 360 + 5 days. The Mathematics of the Haab is 18 times 20. (18 months of 20 days each.) The 5 extra Vayab days give the Haab its next evolutionary notch up. Each cycle of the Haab starts five Suns later than the year prior, thus ascending five steps forward and changing the base energy of the current Haab. The Haab synchronizes with the Tzolk'in every 52 years, creating 18,980 individual perspectives for divination. A interesting note here is in Native American culture a person reaching 52 years old is considered an elder. This is when a person has lived through two complete cycles of the Tzolk'in and the Haab and their relationships between each other.

        These numbers and glyphs of both Tzolk'in and Haab, cycle together endlessly in an ever ascending spiral of evolution. They work together like the gears in a watch. These numbers and glyphs work together to create the web of life as we experience it. In history the calendarswere used by the Cosmic Maya for understanding the position of earth in the universe and the evolutionary stage we are presently in. Remnants of these calendars left behind were intended to be cosmic memory triggers and when resonated with help trigger the memory locked deep inside our DNA. In understanding the sacred cycles of time you have the opportunity to recall the knowledge of the ages.

        www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/cal-kiche.htm

        The Month of Wayeb is the last 5 Days of the Mayan Year... Which Starts on March 21... Making it 16-20th of March...
        • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

          Sun, March 23, 2008 - 3:18 PM
          "The Month of Wayeb is the last 5 Days of the Mayan Year... Which Starts on March 21... Making it 16-20th of March..."

          How do you account for the disjuction between your system and the one I cited? It makes sense that the new year would start with the Vernal Equinox, but leap year days spin it off track. If you go back to the Maya calendar dates during the Classic period, I think you'll find that the days of the Wayeb are different from today.
          • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

            Sun, March 23, 2008 - 3:39 PM
            Aye, The Maya do not Observe Leap year... Thus the Quiche and the Yucatec Calendars are off by 50 days from one another. If you go to my Blog you will see that same difference... The Quiche Living Mayan True Count will have 4 Ahau (Ajaw, Ajpu) on Dec 21 2012, but the Yucatec Calendars would have it as Manik 12... Instead the Maya use Venus Day... every 52 years 1 Ahau is Venus Day... Venus Raises as the Morning Star... That is the Re-Sync Day to correct for the Precession... Why the Living Mayan True count is on the mark... But the extrapolated Yucatec Calendar is off... I hope that helps...
            • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

              Mon, June 29, 2009 - 1:43 PM
              "Sun, March 23, 2008 - 3:39 PM
              Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb
              Aye, The Maya do not Observe Leap year... Thus the Quiche and the Yucatec Calendars are off by 50 days from one another. If you go to my Blog you will see that same difference... The Quiche Living Mayan True Count will have 4 Ahau (Ajaw, Ajpu) on Dec 21 2012, but the Yucatec Calendars would have it as Manik 12... Instead the Maya use Venus Day... every 52 years 1 Ahau is Venus Day... Venus Raises as the Morning Star... That is the Re-Sync Day to correct for the Precession... Why the Living Mayan True count is on the mark... But the extrapolated Yucatec Calendar is off... I hope that helps... "

              Darn, another mistake... Haab and Tzolk'in Resynchronize every 52 years. But it is every 104 years or 2 Rounds that Venus rises as the Morning Star on 1 Ahau.
        • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

          Sun, March 23, 2008 - 3:20 PM
          Here's the set of tools I've been using:

          www.pauahtun.org/Calendar/tools.html
          • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

            Sun, March 23, 2008 - 4:04 PM
            Using those tools and the default correlation....

            For DEC 21, 2012

            I got...

            12.19.19.17.18
            2 Etz'Nab
            1 K'ank'in

            Hmm... Okay, on Dec 21, 2012 it will be 13.0.0.0.0

            "Baktun

            From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

            A baktun is 20 katun cycles of the ancient Maya Long Count Calendar. It contains 144,000 days or 400 tuns or nearly 400 tropical years. The Classic period of Maya civilization occurred during the 8th and 9th baktuns of the current calendrical cycle. The current (12th) baktun will end, or be completed, on 13.0.0.0.0 (December 21, 2012 using the GMT correlation). This also marks the beginning of the 13th baktun, as such a term is usually used among Mayanists.

            J. Eric S. Thompson states that when a Long Count of, say, 9.15.10.0.0 is placed in the 9th baktun, we are almost certainly committing an error. However, that practice is so well established among Maya epigraphers and other students of the Maya that to change it would cause more harm than its perpetuation."

            en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baktun

            Also.... It will be 4 Ahau (Ajaw, Ajpu) as we know from the Creation Monuments... and the Baktun Long Count Dates... Literally Written In Stone...

            Don't know where they got there data... lol
            But it is way off...
            Also it says today is 10 K'an... But it is 8 Ix in Yucatec and 12 Kame in Quiché
            I note they use Yucatec Spellings... but are not in Sync with the Yucatec Calendar
            I use these Tools...

            www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/cal-kiche.html
            www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/...r-kiche.htm

            For the Quiche

            www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/...ucatec.html
            www.kachina.net/~alunajoy/...nverter.htm

            For the Yucatec
            • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

              Sun, March 23, 2008 - 8:22 PM
              "I got... 12.19.19.17.18 2 Etz'Nab 1 K'ank'in"

              Well, that's because you were using the "wrong" correlation: 584285 instead of 584283.

              If you change the correlation factor, you'll get 13.0.0.0.0 4 'Ajaw 3 K'ank'in

              Using that same 584283 correlation, the Wayeb begins this year on March 29, 2008, or 12.19.15.3.12 5 'Eb 0 Wayeb

              If you haven't reviewed how one's choice of correlation affects the 13.0.0.0.0 "end date", you have some homework to do.
              • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                Sun, March 23, 2008 - 8:36 PM
                "Well, that's because you were using the "wrong" correlation: 584285 instead of 584283.
                If you change the correlation factor, you'll get 13.0.0.0.0 4 'Ajaw 3 K'ank'in
                Using that same 584283 correlation, the Wayeb begins this year on March 29, 2008, or 12.19.15.3.12 5 'Eb 0 Wayeb
                If you haven't reviewed how one's choice of correlation affects the 13.0.0.0.0 "end date", you have some homework to do."


                Aye...
                Which Is why I said I used the default Correlation...
                Obviously I know...
                Seems that if you put in the right one it does in fact work...
                I was more wondering Why you have to change it from Default to do that...
                No Wayeb started on March 16 and ended on March 20... March 21st is New Year, Wayeb is the last 5 days... The Quiché Calendar or the Living Mayan True Count AND Yucatec Calendar both Use that date... If you don't know when the year end or begins, Seems you have homework to do...
                • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                  Sun, March 23, 2008 - 8:51 PM
                  In fact when you use the Correct Correlation 584283, It matches perfect with the Quiché Mayan Calendars I posted... And the Converters... Though, As I noted before they use Yucatec Spellings...

                  Just so people know those tools are good... just don't use their Correlation Number that is default...

                  The ones I posted do not need any such fixes, and you can print them out and use to find K'iche' Mayan Dates for your birthday or anytime... I live on these calendars and have more over 10 years nows.
                • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                  Sun, March 23, 2008 - 9:48 PM
                  Well, if the 584283 correlation isn't the right one, there are a lotta people who are gonna be disappointed come December 21, 2012...

                  John Major Jenkins has written the most on this for a long time now:

                  www.levity.com/eschaton/Why2012.html

                  Even the Wikipedia entry says:

                  "The most commonly accepted correlation is the 'Goodman, Martinez, Thompson' correlation (GMT correlation). The GMT correlation establishes that the 0.0.0.0.0 creation date occurred on 3114 BCE September 6 (Julian) or 3114 BCE August 11 (Gregorian), Julian day number (JDN) 584283. This correlation fits the astronomical, ethnographic, carbon dating, and historical sources. However, there have been other correlations that have been proposed at various times, most of which are merely of historical interest, except that by Floyd Lounsbury, two days after the GMT correlation, which is in use by some Maya scholars, such as Linda Schele."
                  en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meso...t_calendar

                  I'm curious to know your own arguments *against* the 584283 correlation.
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                    Sun, March 23, 2008 - 11:33 PM
                    i have never made any... like i said they match K'iche' Living Mayan True Count... Why would you think I did?
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                    Mon, June 29, 2009 - 10:34 AM
                    "John Major Jenkins has written the most on this for a long time now:

                    www.levity.com/eschaton/Why2012.html

                    Even the Wikipedia entry says:

                    "The most commonly accepted correlation is the 'Goodman, Martinez, Thompson' correlation (GMT correlation). The GMT correlation establishes that the 0.0.0.0.0 creation date occurred on 3114 BCE September 6 (Julian) or 3114 BCE August 11 (Gregorian), Julian day number (JDN) 584283. This correlation fits the astronomical, ethnographic, carbon dating, and historical sources. However, there have been other correlations that have been proposed at various times, most of which are merely of historical interest, except that by Floyd Lounsbury, two days after the GMT correlation, which is in use by some Maya scholars, such as Linda Schele."
                    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meso...t_calendar

                    I'm curious to know your own arguments *against* the 584283 correlation. "

                    It is funny to hear you quote Jenkins to me...
                    And once again... I don't have any arguments against the "Goodman, Marinez, Thompson" correlation.
                    Today, 16:44, Monday June 29, 2009 (UTC), in the Long Count is 12.19.16.8.9 (GMT correlation)
                    • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                      Mon, June 29, 2009 - 11:07 AM
                      OH and once again... if you want some Good Info... Including the Actual Mayan Perspective on 2012... (check out the post by that name and follow the link after reading some excerpts) Come Check out Satya Yuga Tribe.

                      tribes.tribe.net/satya2012
                      • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                        Mon, June 29, 2009 - 11:14 AM
                        Here is a Taste of my Tribe.

                        "The TIME of the EQUINOX
                        By Rigoberto Itzep Chanchabac - Daykeeper - Ajkij Maya - Kiche

                        “In these simple lines I express my point of view about the Equinox.”

                        According to our experiences of the MAYA COSMOVISION, the time of the Equinox is the time of the astral commemoration when "Jun Wukub Ajp’ IX Balam Kij" descends into the underworld after his son who has beaten the owners of the underworld. We know very well that for the world or spiritual universe, there was a big battle before the spiritual, material world could take form. It was necessary, this big fight between the light and darkness. The Equinox is a signal that reminds us of that date for eternity, that moment, when the day has become longer than the night. We know the New Year has arrived and is a day of commemoration for the Haab. We call this day Nim Luj A Wasil Kij. It is the day our Grandfathers dreamed and expect to see the hero descend into the Underworld, in a shape like a pyramid, with his head decorated with many feathers, with all the colors of the rainbow. That was the beginning of the light. Since then our ancestors have built temples in the pyramid shape and this was the beginning of the tradition of temple building. But today, almost nobody knows about this historical event.

                        The Celebration of
                        WAJSHIKIB BATZ' OJ in Momostenango
                        By Rigoberto Itzep Chanchabac (Daykeeper-Ajkij Maya-Kiche)

                        Momostenango is a Maya-Kiche village located in the Highlands of Guatemala, and have played an important role as a ceremonial center in the prehispanic Maya-Kiche group. Since remote time they kept their own Mayan Calendar like today. One of the most important date (in the spiritual path) is the wajshikib Batz’ Oj (8 Batz’= 8 weather or Thread, the first thread or the first day) this is the day of the initiation for the Daykeeper (Aj Kij) - The formation of the Aj Kij (Daykeeper Priest) has been preserved for centuries in the oral tradition of the Aj Kijab (priesthood). The Wajshikib Batz’ ceremony and altars are basic to the Maya-Kiche religion, synthesizing the spirits of the universal cosmic element such air, fire, earth, water. Divinities in the Nature that make a only one divinity, when our grandfathers said “JUYUP TAKAJ” (God World). In this way the people of Momostenango keep and preserve their practices of the sacred days of the Maya-Kiche Sacred Calender, every time when is WAJSHIKIB BATZ’, males and females, childrens and youths participate in their own shrines and rituals like they have to do it. “The Ritual New Year, Wajshikib Batz’, is when a person assumes his or her mission to be a Maya Priest (Ajkij) and is ordained."

                        Rigoberto Itzep Chanchovac is Quiche Mayan Elder, Daykeeper and Priest is the director of Mayan Mission Wajshakib Batz of Momostenango, Guatemala. Momostenango is a Maya-Kiche village located in the Highlands of Guatemala, and continues to play an important role as a ceremonial center in the Maya-Kiche world. Rigoberto and many other Elders and Priests from Momostenango facilitate initiations with Center of the SUN Pilgrimages to help one understand our deep and intimate connection to the great creator. Ceremony with the elders fosters a deep reverence for all life. The Elders of Momostenango have retained 85% of their tradition making them a rare invaluable resource for those interested in Maya Cosmovision. Rigoberto offers Maya Destiny Readings, Traditional Kiche Ceremony and wisdom that goes way beyond books written about the Maya. He is also interested in traveling to the USA to meet with his family in the north, so if you are in the position to make arrangements for Rigoberto to travel to the USA to share the Maya Cosmovision please write Rigoberto.

                        You can reach Rigoberto Itzep Chanchabac at
                        misionmaya@yahoo.com.mx
                        Keep letters brief as Rigo will need to have them translated."
                • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                  Sun, March 23, 2008 - 9:52 PM
                  "March 21st is New Year, Wayeb is the last 5 days..."

                  For what years has this been true? And what about the Leap Day thing? In the Gregorian calendar, the Vernal Equinox moves between March 19 and March 22, depending on the year, but the Mayas didn't have leap years.

                  When did the Vernal Equinox happen on the day after the Wayeb ended?
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                    Sun, March 23, 2008 - 11:36 PM
                    Once again the Maya do not observer leap year but instead use Venus Day on 1 Ahau to re-sync and fix the precession... It is true every year... March 21 is Mayan new year...
                    • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                      Mon, March 24, 2008 - 7:48 PM
                      "March 21 is Mayan new year... "

                      You've repeated this several times now, but haven't yet offered any evidence. In what year(s) was "March 21" (I'm assuming you mean the Vernal Equinox?) the first day after the Wayeb?

                      Saying "March 21 is the Mayan new year" makes no sense, since "March 21" is a date on the Gregorian calendar, not the Maya one. The first day after 4 Wayeb is 0 Pop, which is the first day of the Haab. This year (2008), according to the 584283 correlation, 0 Pop falls on April 3.

                      In 2012, 0 Pop will be on April 2.
                      • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                        Mon, June 29, 2009 - 10:15 AM
                        Yes March 21st is Gregorian... And in Mayan it would be a day on the Tzolk'in... What is your Point?
                        Every Year March 21st on the Gregorian Calendar, is Mayan New Year. In Both Yucatec and Ki'che' Mayan Calenders. The Wayeb, Hoopes, Is the LAST Week of the Haab. March 20th (on the Gregorian of course, LMAO) is the LAST DAY of the Haab. So obviously could not be the first day of the Wayeb... Duh... Man your Logic is screwed... (as normal) March 21st would be the First day of the New Year...

                        Pop is a month not a day... Duh... and the Wayeb is 5 days... So the first day after 4 Wayeb is 5 Wayeb... OMG Siriusly Hoopes... Study before Debate.

                        This year, 2009, the Ki'che' Mayan New Year was Toj Junlajuj (11),
                        and was Caban Uc (7) for the Yucatec Mayan New Year.

                        Both are March 21st on the Gregorian Calendar (once again duh)
                        Pop is the first month of the Haab and Caban Uc would be 0 Pop for this Year.

                        March 21st IS the excepted New Year by the Living Mayan, the Ki'che'. Period. Like I keep telling you Hoopes, you need to study more and Actually talk to a Mayan Day-Keepers. I am not Mayan, but I am a Native American Day-Keeper, And I have talked to Mayan Elders about all this. Oh and there is that little Serpent Manifestation on Kukulcan Pyramid. On the Vernal Equinox, every year, no matter what Era... Get it... So despite not observing a Leap Year they could in fact Celebrate the New Year Every Year at the Exact Same Time.
                        Anyway... You prolly are wondering how they keep it in Sync if they don't observe a leap year.
                        They Used Venus. Every 104 Haab or 2 Rounds The Haab and Tzolk'in resynchronized with Venus Rising as the Morning Star on 1 Ahau. The Timings of Venus are Extremely Precise.

                        BTW what does 0 Pop being on April 2 in 2012 have anything to do with anything?

                        Sorry If I was A little Rude.. But this is getting old Hoopes... I obviously know way more about this than you...
                        • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                          Mon, June 29, 2009 - 10:28 AM
                          "BTW what does 0 Pop being on April 2 in 2012 have anything to do with anything?"

                          Oh that was just your Correlation BS..

                          Yeah doesn't Matter... I am on the Mayan Calendar... Not Gregorian... So Bah.
                          I mean sure It matters a lot to those on Gregorian to use the Correct Correlation, and there is some debate still about what is the correct Correlation. But I am using the Current Accepted Correlation. So WTFE.
                    • Re: Getting Ready for the Wayeb

                      Mon, June 29, 2009 - 10:21 AM
                      Yeah, you don't have to Observe a Leap Year if you have a Giant Temple that is a Clock showing you the exact time of the Vernal Equinox (when the Sun is zenith) every year no matter what Era or where the sun is on it's Precession.

                      I know I am repeating, but apparently that is needed.

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